Behringer today introduced what appears to be a close knockoff of the Moog DFAM, the Edge.
The Behringer Edge follows the precedent of their Crave synth, recreating a popular Moog Eurorack format synth as an inexpensive desktop module.
The Edge is a semi-modular percussion synth. Like its inspiration, it features dual VCO’s with pulse and triangle waves, oscillator sync and FM, to let you create a variety of percussive sounds.
It also clones the DFAM’s dual-row 8-step sequencer, so you can control two aspects of the drum synth’s voice on each step.
Behringer says that the Edge offers comprehensive MIDI implementation. They haven’t released specs for the Edge yet, but based on the interface, it looks like MIDI support is limited to receiving MIDI clock, vs offering MIDI control of drum voice parameters or sequencing of pitch and velocity.
Pricing and Availability
The Behringer Edge is priced at $219 USD. Details on availability are to be announced.
Needs a bono companion
That is a good one.
It will be so cheap to make that they give it away free and call it the Pro Bono.
I don’t understand why Behringer didn’t make these Euro compatible, like the originals?
Is it because putting the patch points on the right side would have crossed a line of copying Moog’s design too closely?
Behringer worried about “copying too closely” or “crossing a line”? I think you should consider a career as a stand-up comic.
Sweet! I know Behringer are bad etc, but I genuinely love my Crave.
I was my gateway drug into synths and music production. Best £140 I’ve ever spent.
I can’t wait to get this to go along side it.
Will be getting a skin though because, my god, is that pink hideous!
pretty sure Heinakroon will be able to help you out with his overlays… I love my Behringer Neutron in the new colour I got from him…
Ahahahah! Good point!
come on behringer. rip off the subharmonicon and call it “lord.” don’t fail me.
Looking forward to seeing it done. Uli please!
Moog makes a new, experimental synth. Behringer copies it almost totally only three years later, don’t they realize this kind of thing eventually kills innovation?
Also, what kind of a person would buy this, would you not want to support Moog for trying something new, to encourage them to try new things in the future? It’s not really something you absolutely need for any kind of music so just don’t get it if you can’t afford it, or save up.
Also, it’s gonna break in a couple of years. The Moog one probably won’t, Behringer have to cut corners to bring the price down, economy of scale and owning your factory isn’t enough. I work in pro audio and ~50% of Behringer gear always breaks in a couple of years. I have dozens of examples.
I get copying long gone analog synths of the past, but this is just next-level douchebaggery…
“what kind of a person would buy this”.
Me. I would and will buy this.
I fucking love Moog, but I’m a poor working class person. My Crave cost me £140, the Mother 32 is over £500.
Yes, I know the quality isn’t as good and the resale value is virtually non existent, but I don’t care.
The sound the Crave gives me is fantastic.
And that, surely, is what it’s about.
I get supporting companies, but let’s be honest Moog is a big business not a small boutique.
I genuinely think the price of most Moog stuff is out of reach for a lot of people. Especially if music is a hobby rather than a source of income.
I have their Werkstatt because it was affordable and I wanted to buy into Moog. However, I do feel I could’ve more value out of something else.
That said I am very seriously thinking of investing in a Grandmother!
Moog has well under 100 employees and is employee-owned; not a big company.
You did highlight the reason people buy the Chinese-made copies, though. They’re very cheap.
“I genuinely think the price of most Moog stuff is out of reach for a lot of people.”
That’s BS. I bought my Mother-32 used off a working class musician for $400. He used it for three years and then sold it for two-thirds what he paid for it. So he got a great value with it, and it’s definitely worth $400 to me.
There are always cheaper alternatives than Moog gear. But Moog has cheap software and hardware synths that are excellent, too – not just the high-end synths like the Matriarch and the One. Something like a Sub 25 or a Sub 37 is affordable, great sounding, well built and will keep most of its value.
I’ve been doing this long enough that I feel like I can’t afford to buy cheaply made gear anymore. It always ends up disappointing you.
I bought a Behringer D and was impressed initially, because they did a pretty good job of cloning the synth circuits. But mine was uncalibrated when I got it (which seems to be common) and this revealed that they made the complete noob synth designer mistake of hiding the trim pots inside the case. What the actual f***? If you haven’t had to deal with this yet, consider yourself lucky.
It’s such a clusterf*** that Behringer had to make a video explaining it. And that wasn’t clear enough, so there are video demos of the calibration process that are a half hour long that have tens of thousands of views:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nrZdzyMyr6I
Every analog synth I have with trim pots makes them easily accessible, because analog designers get that analog synths sometimes need to be trimmed to be in tune. The fact that Behringer made an obviously noob screw up like that with the D makes me wonder what they screwed up that isn’t obvious.
BS? How so?
You just said you paid $400. I’m guessing a used Crave would be about $100.
That’s 4 times the price.
I get the resale value is higher and the Moog is higher, and if you buy second hand you may even sell it for a bit more.
But, if your just dipping your toes into synths why not buy a Behringer?
Dongleboob – you’re reading things into what I wrote, instead of reading what I wrote.
I take issue with the idea that people can’t afford something like a Mother-32. It’s a solid synth and I bought one off a musician/restaurant worker, so it’s obviously a synth that’s well within reach of just about anybody.
If you love your Crave, good for you.
I’ve owned synths since the 90s (yes I’m a geezer), so when I bought a Behringer D it was quickly obvious where Behringer cut corners. I’d just rather have a synth without those sort of compromises.
Like I noted before, the D does a good job of copying the Minimoog circuits, so it sounds good. But I’m never going to ‘love’ it, because they made so many dumb design compromises and mistakes.
Wild! you went back in time!
You dont directly support Moog, when you buy Moog synthesizers 2nd hand. So point not taken, sorry.
The DFAM is currently the most popular sound module at Thomann. Mutable Plaits is the most popular eurorack oscillator at Thomann. It’s almost as if Behringer chooses which products to copy based on their popularity on the site.
This is a big reason why Behringer gear is cheap – they don’t have to invest in research and design, and they don’t have to design and develop gear that might not be popular.
The thing that killed most 70’s American synth company is that they developed a lot of products that didn’t pan out to be successful, like the ARP Avatar.
The budget, the facility, the staff… and keep stealing designs of gear that is CURRENTLY manufactured.
Behringer is the Amazon of Music gear. If you’re protesting Behringer, then maybe… you know. Amazon is a lot worse from factories, unionization, employee attrition, product monopolies, ripping off third party sellers, Alexa, etc. Behringer mass produced IP synths, sued a couple people and wrote a bit of nonsense online.
right, everything in society is built on dishonest practice and exploitation… as they say “money makes the world go around”
its well rewarded, dont expect it to stop or even slow down… its just going to keep happening more and more since its so profitable
For many buyers of equipment, the transactions are simple purchases, and not investments.
But for some professionals, the investment goes beyond the self-interests of the user. Yes, they invest in their own gear, and their own work, but they also see their purchase as support for the companies designing and building the gear.
B-word can “get excited” when they release “new” products. And people who don’t know or don’t care can think of their own bottom line.
B-word COULD innovate and develop new and useful products. But they don’t. They are parasites.
Behringer is making synths for hobbyist that wants a collection of synths, vs synthesists and players.
They’re not trying to make top-notch gear that gigging or recording musicians want. And they’re not interested in making anything innovative that more serious synthesists would want.
What they’re doing is lowering the barrier for the hobbyist that wants a collection of synths, by making commodity instruments – just like you can get a ‘Les Paul’ for $150.
I don’t see that as a bad thing (other than some of Behringer’s sleazy business practices). But I’m not in love with the toxic vitriol that some of these newer synth hobbyists bring to the community.
Behringer isn’t the savior of music, they’re just a corporation that makes their money mass producing cheap gear for hobbyists. And companies like Moog and Sequential aren’t ‘scamming’ people – they’re creating original designs and trying to make enough money doing it to avoid the fate that killed them off in the 70s.
Exactly this.
Behringer making the Crave affordable to me gave me the opportunity to decide if I wanted to dive into the synth world.
I loved it and then bought “better” products from more reputable manufacturers.
I think there is a healthy market for this entry level because I believe that someone who cares about music might start off buying a Behringer product but will then move on to other manufacturers.
I have Behringer’s Crave, Neutron and the 606 clone and they all give me immense pleasure and put a big stupid grin on my face every time I jam with them.
Surely that what it’s all about?
Is it?
They do make their own, alongside their copies. Neutron is one, deepmind another.
They abandoned Deepmind development (3D patch editor anyone?) and gave up on developing original synths completely after the Neutron bombed.
It’s too bad, because those were the most interesting synths they’ve done.
The RD-9 ended up being fairly original for a 909 knockoff, so I’d give them credit for that, too.
Create something years behind competitors, completely derivative of an existing product, slap a coat of paint on it and call it the Edge. It’s like watching Fox news!
This company really has no bottom. A hot pink paint job can’t hide their lack of creativity.
“BFAM” after the the why even “Bother 32” …
Missed Opportunity to add something (like pattern sequencer with save slots!)
… not that they aimed for doing something new and creative in the first place …
I like the pink paint, “Bubharmonicon” next?
Does DFAM have MIDI?
I’m pleased that in this case they did their own graphic design, however edgy it is.
It might be a knock off, who knows, but at least it’s not “passing off” in this case.
Does the Behringer Edge really have MIDI?
Behringer always says that their synths have a ‘comprehensive MIDI implementation, but this generally means that they support note on and note off. Out of all their dozens of synths, the Deepmind is the only one with real MIDI support.
In this case, it looks like the Edge is just supporting MIDI clock to run the sequencer, vs an actual MIDI implementation or even MIDI sync. That’s a good feature to have, but don’t confuse that with real MIDI support.
I only have their crave. It has midi in/out/thru 5 pin, note number/note on+off, midi over usb, midi clock, sequence transpose via midi and I can convert midi data to CV via the assign output (I use this for extra modulation source ie. Synced lfo or slow envelope). Seems reasonably comprehensive to me for an analogue synth.
comprehensive enough for me.
No MIDI on the DFAM
More annoyingly it has a no sequencer reset button or input
Still a savage bit of gear
If you believe what Behringer is doing is fundamentally bad and damaging, go study the fashion industry to realize how this economic dance actually works. The “elite” can’t exist without the affordable masses. You all have it backwards.
I don’t see Behringer’s knockoffs as “fundamentally bad and damaging”, I’m just amazed that more people can’t see the obvious, like you do – that Behringer makes the ‘store brand’ knockoffs of the synth world.
Yeesh. The industry existed before their synth division did. I’m also not sure the fashion industry should be looked to as a model for anything. Certainly nothing good/healthy.
No sawtooth wave?
I don’t know why everyone is so uptight about “The Edge”. It will probably be at least a year before Sweetwater, or Amazon (the 2 US-based Mega-dealers for Behringer) even have this in stock. Also, expect the $219 price to go up quickly after it starts shipping due to the on-going chip shortage.
As for impacting Moog, I think they will be just fine. The DFAM and M32 are now nearly legacy products with a well-established user base. The Edge lacks Eurorack compatibility, which will limit its demand with more advanced users, but entry-level users will enjoy it just fine.
Where did anyone express anything ‘uptight’ about the Edge?
Some mild-ish venom at Behringer, but a bit of a headscratcher when talking about companies/brand loyalty and so on. It’s almost as if someone making a cheap version of something already out there so everyone can have a play is ruining it for all the poeple who shell out for “the good stuff”. I’m not new to synths, just new to witnessing the discussion and bedroom snobbery it contains. Quite funny, I hope Behringer carry on making cheap versions of everything going. This one seems ace, just maybe not the colour sceheme I would have picked!
This comment would make sense IF there were NOT R&D expenses from the moog side. But there defintely were, and a lot.
When you buy dfam, you are not just paying for the raw material, components and assembly cost.
You pay for the R&D, user testing, feedbacks, Go to Market, everything.
And it’s not about “ruining for all the people”. It’s about killing the innovation.
Because, if people keeps buying behringer stuff, companies like Moog has very little reason to innovate as it’s going to be mostly expense and risks all on their side, while behringer sits on the safe side (They check what sells well on Thomann and they copy it).
I own a crave, but just because I have already a matriarch, a dfam, a subharmonicon, a minitaur and a mother 32 😉 That’s my way of supporting moog.
You can buy only behringer copy, but you need to understand the implication of what you are doing.
I have nothing against behringer strategy of remaking old synths that are out of production (and probably patent). I think it’s a great strategy, a service to the community and not really damaging anyone (cause we are talking about synth that original manufacturer are not interested in making anymore).
But copying stuff that is brand new (2-4 years) and still under production, that’s a totally different thing
Now do other knock-offs in neon blue, yellow and green so I can style my budget Kebu stack.
This is lame as hell. Which makes it on-brand for Behringer, I guess.
I have a DFAM
It’s worth the money
But given the option I’d rather have paid far less for it because I’m not exactly rich
Most people aren’t
Lame is obviously an opinion you can afford to have
I can’t afford lots of things (including synths, really, despite my ridiculous pile of them). I just don’t buy them. I greatly appreciate companies releasing affordable, budget hardware, but there’s tons of cheap kit that isn’t a cheap chinese knockoff of a currently made product. And compared to say, the non-boutique Korg stuff, Behringer synths aren’t even a good value in terms of features/price.
Good. Keep cloning. Everything is a clone or derivative of something else.
motor synth.
The answer was given by Uli himself since the Keystep situation. It’s about the patents. Moog may still be innovative in your hearts but legally all their patents are from the early seventies and have expired. Again is up to your heart whether you want to pay a lot for ancient tech. I surely won’t. Bye bye Moog.
Waldorf Iridium.
I bought a Moog product. Contacted support, nothing. Contacted support again, nothing again.
I will buy an Edge before I buy a DFAM, And my conscience will be clear. If Moog doesn’t care about me, why should I care about them? This whole “support the originator” argument only works if the originator stands by their sales.
I’ve had only good experience with Moog product support. I bought a DFAM used and it didn’t have a manual and so I contacted them about buying one. They just sent me one, no questions asked.
I think with the knockoffs, the reality is that if it fails you’ll have to throw it in the trash. They’re too cheap to be worth fixing. But they’re cheap enough that most people will probably be glad they had a few years of fun with it.
I’m glad you’ve had a good experience with Moog, I’m sure others have as well. Maybe my experience was atypical, but like I said it was more than once. It was definitely enough to raise the bar on my next purchase decision with them.
When I buy from a cheap brand and fail to get support, it’s of course disappointing but I knew that was a risk. When I buy from premium brand and get that same lack of support, I feel taken.
I have to admit I like the form factor. If Behringer would just make a little effort and add/change a few features, it would not be so cringey. Surely, it does not sound exactly like a Moog.
Sweet work Behringer! Although I have 2xM32’s, DFAM, SubH already – no sale here.
Someone’s just got to complain about everything.
I never heard of the Moog DFAM. I looked it up online.
How is this a knockoff? It doesn’t look the same. Also, it has some features not found on the DFAM.
How can anyone NOT realize this is a knockoff? Based on your previous comments, it seems like you’re in denial about Behringer’s business model.
Behringer specializes in cheap knockoffs. That’s what people want from them – a cheap Minimoog, a cheap DFAM, a cheap Prophet, etc – and they’re good at it because they’ve been making cheap knockoffs of mixers, pedals, monitors, etc for 30 years.
The Edge uses literally the exact same voice architecture as the DFAM, has the same knobs and switches, same patch points, same sequencer, etc. It’s not like the DFAM is a generic design from 40 years ago.
This is the same thing they did with the Mother-32. Starsky Carr did a great video demoing how closely Behringer copied the Mother-32 with the Crave:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JexfJSNVQmM
Behringer did the exact same thing here. The Edge is a direct copy of the DFAM, in Crave form factor. They added MIDI sync for the tempo (a useful change) and removed Eurorack compatibility to cut costs (a really unfortunate change).
It is not the same.
-Edna Mode
Behringer Denial Syndrome in action!
Hey, I’m just relaying what Edna told me.
I see plenty of Behringer hate here from some music pro’s, but let me underline what other’s here have said… I guess I class as a hobbyist “collector” although I’m not a synth room filler. I would truly LOVE to have a MiniMoog Model D, but my impoverished financial state simply won’t justify it right now (one day maybe). Behringer products may well have deserved some criticism for being built down to a price instead of up to a specification, but their little Model D clone has allowed me to have a little box that I can use to play very nearly exactly the same sounds as a real 1970’s Model D makes and that gives me a great deal of joy.
I am sure there are many thousands like me…. we want to make music on a classic analogue synth but can’t afford the real deal. If Behringer hadn’t made their Model D available at the price it is, I wouldn’t have that joy. Clones of recent design current production synths are a whole-nuther discussion admittedly, but I think there are two overlapping markets here… those who will buy a cheap clone and love it and who couldn’t afford the real thing, and those who wouldn’t touch a clone and are lucky enough to have the spare cash (or can justify the credit) to buy the big brand name. I suspect neither market steals much from the other, but those who start with a cheapo clone may well be tempted to buy the big shiny one with the right logo on it when they can afford it.
@Mark Andrew Brighton: Absolutely – and even more interestingly, I would love to see how all “the good people” here spend their everyday money? I would not believe for a single second, that they act the same way when it comes to cars, furniture and even food.
Nearby where I live is a small family company who designs extremely expensive furniture products, mainly made out of glass and stone. Many of their designs are unaffordable for “normal people”, but extensive research and craftsmanship have gone into their designs. And everyday, there are similar designs being offered at megastores for the fraction of the price – with changes just small enough to make a tiny difference, but clearly aiming at potential customers of much more expensive products.
Now let´s just see where those who vigerously complain about Behringer ripping off small family companies buy their next furniture, their next car, their next clothes? I am curious to see these bills in order to underline how these people care about family businesses and supporting innovation.
Is there a demo of this bjunk that even sounds like a DFAM?
I’m all for Behringer copying out of production synths and designing their own takes like the Deepmind but I’m not alright with them cloning a synth currently in production by the original manufacture. It’s just shitty business practice..
That may be true, but in principle, it happens all the time in our world, across many industries.
Yawn. TimS again. Our Professional Behringer defender.
i don’t rly get the move to knock off the DFAM, mostly because the DFAM sounds straight up dogshit. bad move on Behri’s part! shoulda ripped something better-sounding off lol
i said what i said lol
A copy of the Subharmonicon would have been more interesting for me (but not in this awful color!).
But honestly I am still wating for the Behringer VCS3 !
Here’s the thing: this is a con. Judging on previous “inspired” B-products, the DFAM and this BFAM are likely only comparable on a stats page. If you plug this in next to an actual DFAM I’d bet you’d see/hear that while there may be a 1:1 on features the DFAM will give you many many many many more ‘sweet spots’—settings where it all just sounds “good”. The DFAM will invite you to explore and it will quickly reward you for each exploration. I suspect this BFAM will only do “what it said it would do on box” and exactly nothing more. Flat by comparison.
I mean to say: the big Uli-con isn’t stealing other people’s ideas—it’s tricking people into thinking they’re getting something as good as [insert “product inspiration” here] for cheaper. They are not. They’re getting something that ticks the same “specs” boxes but ultimately…. meh.
DFAM: onions, garlic and ginger (all fresh and hand selected for quality) prepared by a great chef and served to you immediately.
BFAM: onions, garlic and ginger (all bruised and bulk selected for cost) assembled by a finance committee and microwaved at 7-11.
Same specs, very different meal.
Sometimes bruised garlic and burnt butter makes all the difference in a mix/recipe.
Cheaper, clearer panel, same fun without woke culture under the line means better
People who support American manufacturing are now relegated to “woke culture”? Super internet sigh.
Just Buy it or don’t buy it FFS! Who the f*** is interested any more in further endless boring discussions about Behringer versus OEMs, the content of which have been posted time and time again already all over the internet. I’d prefer to see comments and information about the device itself and its capabilities and how people would consider using them, etc… not all this polarised bile yet again!
If everyone would shut up about it some might think that buying a Behringer product might actually get them the real deal. It’s clearly not so I’ll say lets keep attacking Behringer with a passion. 😉
The first people using these new products are always the shills aka Influencers on internet. Therefor we need others on forums etc to go against their marketing strategies.
Behringer is your typical dealer that tries to sell junk to junkies. Gimme one good reason why their scames should be allowed to the market in the first place?
“Gimme one good reason why their scames (sic) should be allowed to the market in the first place?”
The same reason that we have cheap(er) “knockoffs” of Strats and Les Pauls: so that musicians without a lot of money can still afford an instrument with similar playability, design, features, and sound.
The only bad thing about this I can see is that the spot where they put the name of the instrument would be better used by another dial or two.
Other than that, this is a great way for people without extra cash to get into analog percussion.
I Like it. And find it funny that people are mad about this. Why would you? So many people own iPhones, made by slaves in China. Now that is something to nag about.